On That Note
Welcome to “On That Note,” a rock-and-roll-centered column that will dive into the big stories, trends, and crazy ideas coming out of the music industry.
Everybody has an opinion on who the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame should induct each year. Go on, state your case: The organization has heard it all. “Even your readers are like, ‘What about so-and-so?’” says chairman John Sykes. “We’re like, ‘All right, how do we do our best?’ We’re always going to leave some great artists behind who we hope will get inducted in the coming years. That’s always been the challenge.” Few would argue, though, against the merits of the 2025 class: Bad Company, Chubby Checker, Joe Cocker, Cyndi Lauper, OutKast, Soundgarden, and the White Stripes were honored as performers at the November ceremony with Warren Zevon, Salt-N-Pepa, Thom Bell, Nicky Hopkins, and Carol Kaye joining the septet through other meritorious categories. It was a fun night full of many decent surprises — Meg White was there in her own way — and it will soon be broadcast as an edited-down special on ABC on New Year’s Day.
Sykes, who has held the role of Rock Hall chairman since 2020, has continued to expand the parameters for how the organization defines “rock and roll” with its inductee choices. So if you’re still keen to debate whether pop, hip-hop, and country artists should be considered for inclusion, luckily, sometimes the boss wants to talk. Once again, Sykes was kind enough to crack open the door to discuss with us a few bemusing topics related to the Rock Hall, such as if the side categories feel like silver medals and if the Fan Vote actually achieves anything. He also shares four artists whom he would love to see in a future class. “You make 12 people happy each year, and 30,000 get mad,” Sykes admits. “So we fight and do our best to recognize the names that will make the final cut.”
When we last talked, you admitted that this job can be a bit thankless because of the number of inductees you can possibly induct in every class. What did you observe about the reaction to this year’s inductees, and did it feel a bit less thankless than usual?
Well, it’s thankless for me because I’m such a fan. I’m a fan of so many artists that I truly would love to put more in there. There’s just not enough room. So I try every year to make sure we don’t forget some of them we’ve missed in the past. This year, in particular, we were able to induct Cyndi Lauper, who influenced so many women that followed her. She finally got her day in the sun and was recognized for what she contributed. So many people think of “Girls Just Want to Have Fun,” but the body of her work is amazing. We also recognized OutKast, who came more than a decade after Cyndi. So we were playing catch-up with some artists, like Cyndi, who should have been in years ago.
But what really struck me this year was the diversity of the class. You had Chubby Checker, you had the White Stripes, you had Soundgarden. The key is that it was a diverse lineup both by gender, by color, and by age. Rock and roll now isn’t one sound from one era; it’s an ever-changing amalgam of sounds. So it’s a challenge for the nominating committee to be able to balance those. They have to play catch-up to artists who have been missed in the past and then honor those that have just become eligible.
No matter what category you’re in, Performer or those other three, it’s the same size plaque on the wall right next to Bob Dylan, Aretha Franklin, and the Beatles.
I was keen to get a better understanding of how the non-performer awards are chosen. I look at someone like my man Warren Zevon, who was nominated once prior and failed to get selected, and he ended up with the Musical Influence Award this year. Salt-N-Pepa received the same award and they had never once been in contention. What’s the usual timeline for solidifying these awards, and who makes the decision?
We see the nominees that come through at the start of the year and then look and see who we’re missing. We have committees for these other categories besides the general performers. People are nominated, we fight about them, we debate, and then we come up with who we feel will balance the inductee body. Three special categories were created from the very start of the organization to recognize artists that aren’t only performers. The Ahmet Ertegun Award is the easiest one — these are producers, record-company heads, agents, and lawyers who supported artists. Without those people, those artists may not have had the success they did. But the two that sometimes get misconstrued are Musical Influence and Musical Excellence. This year, Salt-N-Pepa got in as Musical Influence because they weren’t only just performers, but they had such an influence on female artists that followed them. Musical Excellence used to be the Sideman Award. Those two categories are really about artists, producers, side men, or side women.
And sometimes it’s a scenario such as: Warren Zevon doesn’t get enough recognition from the general voting body. But when we meet with the nominating committee, we see the clear influence that he had on so many artists. So he’s a Musical Influence. No matter what category you’re in, Performer or those other three, it’s the same size plaque on the wall right next to Bob Dylan, Aretha Franklin, and the Beatles. It’s not a secondary award. It’s equal to getting in as a performer.
I’ve, admittedly, found myself referring to these awards as backdoor in nature. There does seem to be a perception around these categories just aren’t at the level of the main performers. What would you articulate to those who feel that way?
These are not also-rans. The category isn’t binary, and it isn’t strict. It’s about any individual, whether they were artists themselves or a producer that influenced those that followed. That’s why you have Warren Zevon in there with Thom Bell, because they both influenced those that followed and changed music. Whereas the performing category has artists who were most likely just known as great performers. These are the artists that did both. Jimmy Buffett is a perfect example. We had 11 Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductees show up at his tribute concert. That made us think, Wait a minute. This guy is perfect for Musical Excellence. So that’s why there’s no back door at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. We’re exhausted in the way we determine who’s going to be recognized. Each artist receives the same amount of effort when we look at if we’re inducting them.
Chubby Checker caused the most confusing news cycle for this year’s induction class: Despite stating for decades that he should be inducted, he refused to attend the ceremony and it was instead arranged for him to accept the award at one of his concerts. It was an unprecedented hand-off. Can you tell me more about why you allowed this?
Chubby had a show that night and he couldn’t cancel. That’s why we allowed it. He was playing in Santa Barbara, and he didn’t want to let his fans down — that’s how honorable Chubby Checker is. Otherwise we ask that the inductees come, but if they can’t because they have a show booked, we’re not going to ask them to cancel and not make money that night. We would do it for anyone if they had a show already booked. We understand that that’s how you get paid.
Would you allow other lax arrangements if an artist demanded it? Like, if they didn’t feel like coming and wanted to accept it from their home?
No, we would never do that. If someone doesn’t want to come, we’ll honor them appropriately at the ceremony and we’ll send them the statue. We would never not honor them. We just say, “Fine, it’s your choice, but you’re still getting in. God bless you.” We’ve had very few artists not show up in the past. There’s no animosity. It’s a very positive vibe at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame.
And then you have someone like Carol Kaye, who just flat-out refused to accept the award or attend the ceremony. Like you said, this isn’t new — plenty of artists have turned down the Rock Hall over the decades. My favorite will always be the Sex Pistols. But when you’re aware that someone will decline the award, what’s your plan? Do you try to talk to them privately and make your case?
We sure do. Dolly Parton first turned it down because she said she wasn’t rock and roll. She thought rock and roll was “rock” in the strictest sense of the word. As Chuck D once said, “There’s rock and there’s the roll.” It’s inclusive. Rock is a great sound, but it’s only one part of rock and roll. Dolly thought the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame was a bunch of white guys with long hair playing guitars. When we told her that Brenda Lee, Hank Williams, and Johnny Cash have been inducted, and the country is one of the cornerstones of rock and roll, she went, “Wow, you should do a better job telling people this stuff.” We laughed. I said, “That’s our goal right now. We want to let people know that rock and roll isn’t about one sound, it’s about rebellion and attitude. And, Miss Dolly, you’re all about rebellion and attitude.” Then she said, “Well then, I’m coming.”
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What I’ve been trying to do in my time here is help people understand that I’m not changing what rock and roll is all about. I’m going back to the original idea of rock and roll, which was country, gospel, and rhythm and blues all mixed together in this crazy jumbo. If there’s any music that was a cornerstone of rock and roll, it’s Black music. Six of the first ten inductees were Black. If you look at Chuck Berry, Little Richard, Fats Domino, and James Brown, those artists fueled an entire generation of young white kids to cover their music. Robert Johnson wrote “Crossroads,” and Cream made it famous. Willie Dixon wrote “Spoonful,” and Cream made it famous. Chuck Berry wrote “Roll Over Beethoven,” and the Beatles made it famous. So I’m really trying to have people understand why hip-hop, country, and pop artists are in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Because they all have one thing in common — they have attitude and move culture.
For someone like Meg White, who has maintained a private life for the majority of the millennium, did you even try to contact her for the White Stripes’ induction?
We reached out, and Meg very politely said, “I can’t come.” Jack understood that there were no hard feelings. In fact, Meg helped Jack write his speech as you heard from the stage. It had nothing to do with animosity or the past. She just feels uncomfortable playing in public. For that reason, Jack didn’t perform that night. We instead had incredible performances from Twenty One Pilots and Olivia Rodrigo. It shows how much young artists think of being in the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame and how much they admire those who are being inducted. Those are their heroes.
We know who can stuff the ballot box and who can’t.
I’d love to know more about how presenters are paired with inductees. For this year’s ceremony, you had Iggy Pop, who made total sense for the White Stripes, and then Jim Carrey, a name nobody would’ve guessed for Soundgarden. Is the normal process reaching out to people to gauge their interest, or do you field a bunch of offers and deliberate?
We go to the inductees and ask, “Who would you love to induct you that night?” We sometimes have to give them some suggestions. But sometimes they’ll come up with some surprises, like Soundgarden suggesting Jim. We found that a lot of movie stars, like Brad Pitt, love Soundgarden. In the seven or eight months planning the show, we basically go through the process of who’s around, who’s available, but more importantly, who the inductee would feel comfortable with. It’s a very collaborative process and well thought out, to the point where I’m exhausted. But you’ve got to put the work in. This is the biggest night of these artists’ lives. This is music’s highest honor. When you pass away, the first line on the obituary is, “Rock and Roll Hall of Fame inductee.” So we go out of our way to make sure that they feel respected and taken care of.
Would you say there’s a correlation of artists becoming chummy with attending Rock Hall ceremonies and earning a future nomination? For example, most recently, Billy Idol appeared for the first time in 2024 to honor Ozzy Osbourne and got his first nomination a few months later.
I don’t think there’s any direct correlation. I do think you’re right. Artists come on and support others, but there’s no hard-and-fast rule that if you participate in the show, you’re going to get a nomination. It obviously puts your name front and center when people are looking at it. What we feel is most of these artists show up because they love it. Olivia Rodrigo won’t be eligible for 20 more years, but she wants to be there because she’s an old soul. She sang for Carly Simon, she sang with Sheryl Crow, and this year she sang for the White Stripes. I’m sure she’ll get in one day when I’m in the nursing home.
Like clockwork, there’s a bunch of noise surrounding the Fan Vote because voters don’t seem to realize that whoever wins isn’t guaranteed an induction. There was more of a tizzy than usual in 2025 because Phish won, didn’t make the cut, and their fans are very loyal and loud. Do you think the Fan Vote is working as it is or should it be reconfigured in some way?
This is a great question because we should do a better job communicating to fans what this award is. It has very little to do with who gets inducted, but it rather draws attention. The winner of the Fan Vote gets one vote out of 1,200 in the final ballot. Being in this business for years, I know fan clubs are very aggressive. Artists who have great fan clubs tend to get a lot of votes. So we know who can stuff the ballot box and who can’t.
So we certainly look at the Fan Vote, but it’s in no way, shape, or form an indication of who’s going to get in. Every year I make sure I tell our staff, “Make that clear to everyone.” And if everyone’s clear on what it is, then it’s fun. It’s great to see when fans weigh in. I just hope it’s not a fixed system with fan clubs where they play a game, but otherwise it’s cool to see who wins. We just can’t let fans think that’s going to influence whether they get it or not. Believe me, we get the calls from these people. I think the bottom line is, I look at that list every year and I say, “Is there anyone in this list that shouldn’t be in the Hall of Fame? Absolutely not.”
Last year, you were nice enough to indulge me with a lightning round of artists who haven’t yet been inducted and their future probability. Shall we continue the tradition?
Let’s do it. I really don’t have that influence that you think I do, but I have committees that I can talk to. I’ll give you my honest opinion.
This one is for my mother and several of Vulture’s anonymous Rock Hall dream ballots: the Monkees. I know Jann Wenner despised those guys and likely blocked any chance for them to get in.
I remember when they came on television in 1967 when I was a teenager. They were like the Beatles to us when we were kids. But as time passed, people realized that their music wasn’t what really moved culture. I think they haven’t gotten the pass because they didn’t really write a lot of those songs. There was a backroom songwriting, so that hurt them. But their name continues to come up.
Chic, which has the most-ever nominations — 11 — without an induction. Is this just a lost cause at this point?
Nile Rodgers got in under Musical Excellence because he was such a big part of Chic and, of course, he’s a great producer. He’s a classic example of an artist who’s influenced other artists. I think the fact that Nile is already in as an individual slows the committee down a bit, but Chic is deserving and their name absolutely continues to come up.
I’d like to check on the status of Iron Maiden and ask if you feel metal has been well represented in the Rock Hall.
Iron Maiden has been overlooked by us. I’ll just say that. With Rick Krim coming in as the head of the nominating committee now, he has helped a lot of metal artists get in. Their day will come.
This band is eligible for the first time in 2026, so this is a bit of a twofold question: One, do you envision the Strokes immediately generating enough buzz in the nominating committee, and two, what’s your general ideology for inaugural-year inductees?
To get in the first-year ballot, you not only have to be an artist that’s very influential and cool but you have to have truly moved culture. For reference, U2 and Bruce Springsteen were first-year inductees. I agree that the Strokes are very important. I predict that name will come up now in many of our meetings. But see, that’s the problem. You named four artists and there’s four, eight, 12, 16 to be considered.
The name you threw in to show your personal support was Joe Cocker, who wound up getting inducted this year. Who’s at the top of your list getting the “Sykes bump” now?
I think Sting should get in. I think Usher should get in. I think Lenny Kravitz should get in. I think Mariah Carey should get in. It’s like the teacher of the class and you wonder if your class listens to you, and half the time they don’t.
